I used to be on the same boat Doob... Ran different combos of cool and warm cfls, mega sized(200 watt) cfls etc. One time, I made my own ceiling of light with 15 cool and 15 warm 23 watt cfls mounted to a 1/2" plywood board in a grow cab. I stopped doing that though... 690 watts cfl was producing less yield for me than 250 watts of HID. I do like the cool running option though, HID tends to be a great space heater. Love my setup in winter though! Warmest room in the house! LOL!

Peace, E1

Update:
I forgot to post on friday as my InterLux super hps arrived. Let me just give a hands on first impression of this bulb.


InterLux Super HPS

The first thing I noticed about this bulb was its build quality. It feels solid in your hands, the innards don't rattle like hell as cheap bulbs do. The glass is thick and smoothed to window quality. I've seen bulbs before that had glass with waves and slight bumps to them. This may not seem important, but the smoothness and clarity of the glass is a major factor in proper light distribution and spectral output. A cheaply made bulb can have inferior quality glass and this may reduce its performance regardless of the arc tube quality.
The arc tube itself is slightly thinner, yet longer. I really appreciate this feature as the light distribution is more even when the source is spread for a longer distance.

InterLux arc tube

Like the Hortilux and some other high end bulbs, the InterLux seems to carry a resistor between the two electrodes. I'm not quite sure what its purpose is in an hps, I just know I don't see these on cheap bulbs. Perhaps it adds a level of protection for the arc tube in case of over voltage or a high ignition level given by some ballasts.
Nothing really to report on the packaging, it is quite simply a standard white featureless hid sleeve. No logos or fancy colored images. It seems they put all the money into the bulb and not the packaging...***cough***Digilux***cough***

I've already seen how well these bulbs perform... I watched these things in action for over 2.5 grows. All we have to do now is throw her in my rotation!

Peace, E1

Yeah, I'm at that point myself, with over 900watts of CFLs, it's time to start looking at the obvious alternative. One big issue is, as you mentioned, heat build-up. My two rooms are hitting the mid-90F range just using floros, so imagine I could boil water if those were HIDs! I'll probably end up not growing in the summer months either way, as I produce more than enough as it is.

At least I now know where to turn when I start looking for HIDs. Was surprised to see how much of a difference there could be between two types of HPS lights..live and learn

I think that we have all tried this gambit a time or two, I have tried every light combination that there is and guess what, I always come back to the good ole 1000 watt hps.

If one just wants to grow pot, none of this matters but if they desire to step into a league of their own where they are producing and smoking the absolute dankest smoke on the planet there are a few things that must be done.

1. we must be willing to put out the bucks for proper ac and ventilation where the plants never see a higher temp than 75f at the hottest part of the day.
2. Do not try to cheat mother nature and fool her by running high temps and supplementing Co2. Just keep the temps where they need to be.
3. Quit fucking with low wattage substitutes in the flower room and get a 6 or 8 inch cool tube with a 550 cfm fan or larger and a 1000 hps and if need be an in room portable ac unit.
(I know this is not the budget way, but it is the way to attain dankness).

Nice work there E1!

I can't afford to go with digital at the moment but I'd like to get a couple of these Ceramic Metal Halides to go with my two 400W HPS magnetic ballasts. There spectrum looks real nice and and they are half the price of an EYE. The chart is too small but compares the 400 CMH to a standard HPS of the same wattage.

Hell yeah LabRat! I ran those CMH bulbs the entire grow cycle for a few grows. They're awesome bulbs! I also used them for a long time as my veg bulbs and transition bulbs(first two weeks 12/12).
I was reluctant to change to digital because at the time I bought my magnetic, digitals were still not refined enough IMO. I didn't want to waste time with a product that had not shown a CLEAR benefit over magnetic.

My conclusion after running first my Lumatek digital w/superlumens switch and a MaxLume HPS... THEN seing again not only the difference between mag and digi, but the difference between Quantum and Phantom!

Without going into scientific details and studies. Let me just tell you the clear difference I see with my bare eyes. With identical wattage setups and same strains... With all other variables like medium, nutrients, air quality etc accounted for... I see a very clear picture that tells me the plants grow BEST under digital light. They seem happier. The plants really DO yield better under digital light. The buds achieve a higher level of density than magnetic can put out.
After hearing (and seeing) the technology behind the Phantom digital... Seeing it perform. I made a decision that I would use this technology in my grow.
From what I've been told from the tech at hydrofarm. The Phantom's cpu is more advanced than most people realize. The bulb signal it puts out is so clean and controlled compared to other ballasts. Other ballasts like Quantum and NextGen just drive the bulbs at whatever frequency the company intended. The Phantom actually filters and stabilizes the frequency while also running diagnostics to throttle performance. It truly is a SMART ballast, not just another electronic ballast.

As a fellow grower, I highly recommend this ballast. In fact, I recommend digital technology in general. I can clearly see the growth benefits from grow to grow. This technology coupled with bulbs designed to handle
it, can really drive your yield and quality potential through the roof!
I've broken yield RECORDS of mine using digital ballasts!

Oh Rebel... I totally agree with ya on using HIDs for superior growth. However, I hold firmly that your actual grow area footprint is what determines your wattage. If every grow area used a 1000 watter, a lot of people would have the same thing Moses did... A burning bush!
Different wattage HIDs are for different sized gardens and different grower needs. 4.5-7 ounces every 10 weeks is all I need to be medicated every day. Any more would be a waste as I don't sell or anything.
Not too many people I know can squeeze that sized organic harvest from a 250 watt HPS.


Peace, E1

I'm thinking a 250W MH would be perfect for my veg closet. It's 30"d x 50"w x 68"h. One side will have a shelf for clones etc and have some CFLs for them. There will be enough room to veg two tubs for ScroGs.

I have one of those energy meters and ran it using 1-400W MH, a 400W HPS and a 150W Hps. The total was only 962W. I figure an extra 12 watts isn't enough loss to run out and buy digital unless I need to reach for the top.

Tho if I get that 250 I'll aim for the Phantom.



You know anything about those Advanced Nutrients BadAss ballasts? They hype them up a lot but I've never heard any growers talking about them.

Lousy pic of the sine waves from it on the bottom, Quantum on the top and Lumatek in the middle for what that's worth.

Yes, I've had quite a bit of experience with these where I work. We deal closely with Advanced as they're name is very recognized because of their advertizing. Our shop once carried them because growers were curious... After a few months people just stopped buying them and switched to quantum. This was before the Phantom came to our shop.

When dealing with Advanced Nutrients techs, I would often pick their brains on their products. They told me that square wave technology is not for what most people think it is. They went on to tell me its purpose was to address the issue of unclean signals from ballasts like Lumatek. By going with square wave, they were able to lessen the chance of bulb blowout. This is why they drive their bulbs at 100Hz, to help save your bulbs. It really has nothing to due with light "quality".
From my research, Hydrofarm's answer to Advanced was to clean up, regulate and refine the high frequency... Not dumb it down to 100Hz. This design in the Phantom allows the bulb to be driven to its highest output WITHOUT endangering the bulbs reliability or spectral output. If the ballast's signal is 100% clean to begin with, you don't need to change the delivery technology. Advanced is always trying to win over the minds of eager gardeners... There's a reason our shop doesn't carry Badass ballasts anymore, nobody wants to buy them! Their hype does not live up to their product.

You see the peaks in those sine wave graphs? The Phantom's circuitry removes those sharp cutoff points/dropoff points making the signal less harsh on the bulbs. I guess if you were to name the signal it would be "curved wave" technology!?!? LOL!

I use SOME of Advanced Nutrients products because they DO have the science behind them and are pharmaceutically pure in nature. I use Rhino Skin(potassium silicate), Mother Earth Super Tea, Liquid Carboload, and Nirvana. BUT you have to be selective about what information you're being fed. Advanced wants you to believe that the ONLY way to produce amazing medicine is to use ALL their products and gimmicks. Sorry, but I don't buy their BS. I pick and choose from their nutrients, but I won't buy their ballast. We've even loaned these ballasts out to our customers for a few grows at a time with fresh Digilux bulbs in the package. The growers themselves report they perform just as good as their Quantum ballast. There is no apparent difference in yield or end quality.
The only two other ballasts I've seen that have much promise are the Hortilux plantinum series and the SolisTek ballasts. I like the technology behind them.

One thing that has taken the market by storm is the dimming and overdrive options on ballasts. I will not use features like this on ANY ballast! Why? Simply put, it changes the operating parameters and spectral power distribution of your bulbs. Don't even let me start on how damaging overdriving your hps can be. I've seen arc tubes violently rupture from superlumens and other boosting features. If a bulb is designed to take an exact amount of wattage and convert it into its designed spectral output, what makes you think changing its voltage/wattage won't change its performance? It's like taking a car engine that's designed to run at a max of 10,000 RPMs and forcing it to run at 13,000 RPMs.

Peace, E1

Back in the day, Cadillac put out a model that had an engine that ran on 4,6 or 8 cylinders, dependent upon multipole variables. It turned out to be a bad idea and only lasted a few years before they just disapeared.

Good stuff to hear. Electronics is not my forte and I like to do a lot of research before I invest in something new and pricey. Better that than crap unless the crap is free.

My old magnetics are at least 20 years old and still working OK. Nice new stuff is best tho.

Champagne taste with a beer budget!

I like and use bits of AN nutes too but don't follow their program.

Their base 3 part is changed so I'm probably switching when I run out of these. I've got some new ones for free. H.O.G., High Output Garden. Formulated almost exactly the same as the older AN. Only in parts of Canada, mostly BC and a couple of Alberta locations. They list CA as the only state they're in but no retailer listed on that page. H.O.G.

We shall see how they work. Maybe two tubs with 2 or 3 clones in each. I have the clones and all the other stuff. AN and HOG grow-off. I'm liking the sound of that.