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#1637660 - 05/13/10 12:26 AM Re: Global Warming is not due to human contribution of * [Re: RollnToke]
davidmalmolevine Offline
Ganja God
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Registered: 09/17/99
Posts: 21459
Loc: BC
"By 2032, the Earth`s population is expected to reach 11 billion souls."

According to who?

" So these worries about overpopulation are unfounded?

When Paul Ehrlich wrote his famous book ["The Population Bomb"], women were having an average around the world of five or six children; now they’re having an average of 2.6. Fertility rates around the world have halved. That’s not just true in Europe and North America; they’re way below replacement levels in most of East Asia now. Not just China but Japan, Korea, Vietnam and Burma have replacement rates of fertility or below. Around the world, fertility rates have been coming down really sharply. So the population bomb as we’ve conceived it before really isn’t there. There’s still population growth going on, but that’s going to stabilize."

http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2010/04/19/population_crash_ext2010







"Of course you know, that if all anyone did was burn cow chips for fuel, C02 levels would continue rising also."

Lucky for us, HEMP ETHANOL reverses the greenhouse effect:

“Each crop produces as much oxygen as it will later produce of CO2 if every bit of it is burned as fuel, creating a balanced cycle. Furthermore, hemp deposits 10 percent of its mass in the soil as roots and up to 30 percent as leaves which drop during the growing season. This means that some 20 to 40 percent more oxygen can be produced each season than will later be consumed as fuel – a net gain in clean air. Call it a “reverse greenhouse effect”.” -Chris Conrad, “Hemp – Lifeline to the Future”, (122)

http://hemp-ethanol.blogspot.com/2008/01/part-three-politics-of-hemp-fuels.html







"Next up is clean potable water. We`ll be drowning in waste emitting high levels of methane."

Unless we switch to hemp ethanol. Ethanol spills are much smaller that oil spills because the production is more localized ... and it evaporates so clean up is easy:

http://mankatofreepress.com/local/x519261231/Ethanol-spill-decision-No-cleanup-required







"Famine, war, pestilence and the cyclical crash of a species is about the only answer to mankind`s dilemma."

For fucked up right-wing trolls who are too lazy to research anything they discuss on the internet, maybe. But people who read and research have many more options.










"The rest is just more growth. You have to have a robust economy to pay for changes."

Yeah ... if we just stopped spending money on wars, drug wars and protection rackets and corporate welfare and corporate bailouts and greed and corruption there would be plenty of money for the things that matter:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKfF-nxjDi0






"According to many researchers in the field of climate science, it has already warmed enough to accelerate methane gas into the atmosphere, and we`re getting hotter. I say, technology for adaptation, not stop something beyond the tipping point."

Anything to prevent the polluters from having to slow down their bullshit oil wars, oil spills and climate change. Fuck that - SWITCH SUBSIDIES NOW!











"I rather do distrust Hansen`s work and theory that we can stop the warming. Hansen hasn`t been very forthcoming with the truth. It would take a police state to enforce his suggestions."

It would only take the switching of subsidies.






"Hansen says nuclear power is safe So is driving a car......"

Link please.
_________________________
"making the earth a common treasury for all, both rich and poor." Gerrard Winstanley; April 20, 1649

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#1638080 - 05/14/10 05:23 PM Re: Global Warming is not due to human contribution of [Re: davidmalmolevine]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
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Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
Whether it is 11 billion or a paltry 9 billion really does not matter. I still subscribe to Paul R. Ehrlich`s view that in the not too distant future the Earth`s human population will outgrow even it`s food and water supply

In a 2004 Grist Magazine interview,[7] Ehrlich acknowledged some specific predictions he had made, in the years around the time the Population Bomb was published, that had not come to pass. However, as to a number of his fundamental ideas and assertions he maintained that facts and science proved them correct.

In answer to the question: "Were your predictions in The Population Bomb right?", Ehrlich responded:

Anne and I have always followed U.N. population projections as modified by the Population Reference Bureau -- so we never made "predictions," even though idiots think we have. When I wrote The Population Bomb in 1968, there were 3.5 billion people. Since then we've added another 2.8 billion -- many more than the total population (2 billion) when I was born in 1932. If that's not a population explosion, what is? My basic claims (and those of the many scientific colleagues who reviewed my work) were that population growth was a major problem. Fifty-eight academies of science said that same thing in 1994, as did the world scientists' warning to humanity in the same year. My view has become depressingly mainline! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Population_Bomb

If you think for one second your totalitarian mindset which suggests that human beings can be coerced into following any asshole like yourself beyond their death, you`re delusional. I`ve always belieeved that about you anyway. As Erlich points out, the Earth`s population is still growing. Unless war, famine and pestilence intervene, none of your bullshit will prevent world population explosions.


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#1638083 - 05/14/10 05:27 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: energyhazard]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
*

Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
Obama Administration Approves 27 Offshore Drilling Projects After Gulf Oil Spill
Monday May 10, 2010
Here's some news that points to such shocking irresponsibility by the federal government that it is almost impossible to believe.

Since April 20, when the Deepwater Horizon offshore oil rig exploded, killing 11 workers and starting an oil spill that continues to pollute the Gulf of Mexico and threaten the fragile marine and coastal environments of several southern states, the Obama administration has quietly approved 27 new offshore drilling projects.

Twenty-six of those projects were approved under the same environmental review exemption that was used to green-light the deadly BP drilling project that led to the current disaster. Essentially, those 26 projects received environmental waivers or exemptions from the Minerals Management Service (MMS), a division of the U.S. Interior Department. Incredibly, two of those approvals were for new BP offshore drilling projects, despite BP's responsibility in the current disaster and the company's poor safety record.


All this took place while emergency crews were working feverishly to stop the flow of millions of gallons of crude oil from an underwater oil well that are drifting toward the fragile Gulf Coast. And it all happened while the White House was promising to do everything necessary to ensure better safety for offshore drilling, and while David Axelrod, one of President Obama's closest advisors, was telling reporters that no new offshore drilling projects would be allowed to proceed until a thorough investigation of the BP Deepwater Horizon oil spill was complete.

The Center for Biological Diversity, a respected environmental group, reported the news on Friday, shortly after MMS came under fire for exempting the BP offshore drilling plan from environmental review. Reports showed that MMS had used a loophole in the National Environmental Policy Act that is intended to apply only to projects such as hiking trails, which have no, or very few, potential environmental problems. MMS drew even more criticism when it was discovered that the agency has been exempting hundreds of dangerous offshore oil drilling projects in the Gulf of Mexico every year.

"The MMS has learned absolutely nothing from this national catastrophe," said Kierán Suckling, executive director of the Center for Biological Diversity, "It is still illegally exempting dangerous offshore drilling projects in the Gulf of Mexico from all environmental review. It is outrageous and unacceptable."

Reacting to the growing controversy surrounding MMS and its practice of waiving environmental review for potentially dangerous offshore drilling projects, U.S. Secretary Ken Salazar last week announced that he was banning approval of all new offshore oil drilling permits. But Salazar's announcement turned out to be little more than PR intended to turn down the public and political heat being aimed at his office.

Salazar's moratorium doesn't halt approval of drilling plans and environmental exemptions that are at the center of the problem. On Friday [May 7, 2010], the Interior Department acknowledged that it has not stopped approving environmental exemptions and drilling plans. All Salazar put on hold was issuance of a last technical check that does not involve any environmental review.

"Salazar is playing a cynical shell game, making the public think he stopped issuing the faulty approvals that allowed the disastrous BP drilling to occur, when in fact he has given MMS the green light to keep issuing those very same approvals," Suckling said. "The only thing Salazar has stopped is the final, technical check-off which comes long after the environmental review. His media sleight of hand does nothing to fix the broken system that allowed what may be the greatest environmental catastrophe of our generation to occur."

At the very least, Salazar and the MMS have shown a serious lack of judgment in exempting 26 new oil wells in the midst of an ongoing environmental and economic disaster in the Gulf of Mexico that seems to have no foreseeable end. At worst, those actions, combined with the long history of MMS exempting hundreds of offshore drilling projects from environmental review, is a betrayal of public trust that approaches criminal behavior. http://environment.about.com/b/2010/05/1...f-oil-spill.htm

I see no betrayal by Obama here. All I see is him stepping around stupid energyhazards who have their heads up their asses to begin with.
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#1638164 - 05/15/10 01:22 AM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: energyhazard]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
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Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
May 13, 2010
U.S. Said to Allow Drilling Without Needed Permits
By IAN URBINA
WASHINGTON — The federal Minerals Management Service gave permission to BP and dozens of other oil companies to drill in the Gulf of Mexico without first getting required permits from another agency that assesses threats to endangered species — and despite strong warnings from that agency about the impact the drilling was likely to have on the gulf.

Those approvals, federal records show, include one for the well drilled by the Deepwater Horizon rig, which exploded on April 20, killing 11 workers and resulting in thousands of barrels of oil spilling into the gulf each day.

The Minerals Management Service, or M.M.S., also routinely overruled its staff biologists and engineers who raised concerns about the safety and the environmental impact of certain drilling proposals in the gulf and in Alaska, according to a half-dozen current and former agency scientists.

Those scientists said they were also regularly pressured by agency officials to change the findings of their internal studies if they predicted that an accident was likely to occur or if wildlife might be harmed.

Under the Endangered Species Act and the Marine Mammal Protection Act, the Minerals Management Service is required to get permits to allow drilling where it might harm endangered species or marine mammals.

The National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, or NOAA, is partly responsible for protecting endangered species and marine mammals. It has said on repeated occasions that drilling in the gulf affects these animals, but the minerals agency since January 2009 has approved at least three huge lease sales, 103 seismic blasting projects and 346 drilling plans. Agency records also show that permission for those projects and plans was granted without getting the permits required under federal law.

“M.M.S. has given up any pretense of regulating the offshore oil industry,” said Kierán Suckling, director of the Center for Biological Diversity, an environmental advocacy group in Tucson, which filed notice of intent to sue the agency over its noncompliance with federal law concerning endangered species. “The agency seems to think its mission is to help the oil industry evade environmental laws.”

Kendra Barkoff, a spokeswoman for the Minerals Management Service, said her agency had full consultations with NOAA about endangered species in the gulf. But she declined to respond to additional questions about whether her agency had obtained the relevant permits.

Federal records indicate that these consultations ended with NOAA instructing the minerals agency that continued drilling in the gulf was harming endangered marine mammals and that the agency needed to get permits to be in compliance with federal law.

Responding to the accusations that agency scientists were being silenced, Ms. Barkoff added, “Under the previous administration, there was a pattern of suppressing science in decisions, and we are working very hard to change the culture and empower scientists in the Department of the Interior.”

On Tuesday, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar announced plans to reorganize the minerals agency to improve its regulatory role by separating safety oversight from the division that collects royalties from oil and gas companies. But that reorganization is not likely to have any bearing on how and whether the agency seeks required permits from other agencies like NOAA.

Criticism of the minerals agency has grown in recent days as more information has emerged about how it handled drilling in the gulf.

In a letter from September 2009, obtained by The New York Times, NOAA accused the minerals agency of a pattern of understating the likelihood and potential consequences of a major spill in the gulf and understating the frequency of spills that have already occurred there.

The letter accuses the agency of highlighting the safety of offshore oil drilling operations while overlooking more recent evidence to the contrary. The data used by the agency to justify its approval of drilling operations in the gulf play down the fact that spills have been increasing and understate the “risks and impacts of accidental spills,” the letter states. NOAA declined several requests for comment.

The accusation that the minerals agency has ignored risks is also being levied by scientists working for the agency.

Managers at the agency have routinely overruled staff scientists whose findings highlight the environmental risks of drilling, according to a half-dozen current or former agency scientists.

The scientists, none of whom wanted to be quoted by name for fear of reprisals by the agency or by those in the industry, said they had repeatedly had their scientific findings changed to indicate no environmental impact or had their calculations of spill risks downgraded.

“You simply are not allowed to conclude that the drilling will have an impact,” said one scientist who has worked for the minerals agency for more than a decade. “If you find the risks of a spill are high or you conclude that a certain species will be affected, your report gets disappeared in a desk drawer and they find another scientist to redo it or they rewrite it for you.”

Another biologist who left the agency in 2005 after more than five years said that agency officials went out of their way to accommodate the oil and gas industry.

He said, for example, that seismic activity from drilling can have a devastating effect on mammals and fish, but that agency officials rarely enforced the regulations meant to limit those effects.

He also said the agency routinely ceded to the drilling companies the responsibility for monitoring species that live or spawn near the drilling projects.

“What I observed was M.M.S. was trying to undermine the monitoring and mitigation requirements that would be imposed on the industry,” he said.

Aside from allowing BP and other companies to drill in the gulf without getting the required permits from NOAA, the minerals agency has also given BP and other drilling companies in the gulf blanket exemptions from having to provide environmental impact statements.

Much as BP’s drilling plan asserted that there was no chance of an oil spill, the company also claimed in federal documents that its drilling would not have any adverse effect on endangered species.

The gulf is known for its biodiversity. Various endangered species are found in the area where the Deepwater Horizon was drilling, including sperm whales, blue whales and fin whales.

In some instances, the minerals agency has indeed sought and received permits in the gulf to harm certain endangered species like green and loggerhead sea turtles. But the agency has not received these permits for endangered species like the sperm and humpback whales, which are more common in the areas where drilling occurs and thus are more likely to be affected.

Tensions between scientists and managers at the agency erupted in one case last year involving a rig in the gulf called the BP Atlantis. An agency scientist complained to his bosses of catastrophic safety and environmental violations. The scientist said these complaints were ignored, so he took his concerns to higher officials at the Interior Department.

“The purpose of this letter is to restate in writing our concern that the BP Atlantis project presently poses a threat of serious, immediate, potentially irreparable and catastrophic harm to the waters of the Gulf of Mexico and its marine environment, and to summarize how BP’s conduct has violated federal law and regulations,” Kenneth Abbott, the agency scientist, wrote in a letter to officials at the Interior Department that was dated May 27.

The letter added: “From our conversation on the phone, we understand that M.M.S. is already aware that undersea manifolds have been leaking and that major flow lines must already be replaced. Failure of this critical undersea equipment has potentially catastrophic environmental consequences.”

Almost two months before the Deepwater Horizon exploded, Representative Raúl M. Grijalva, Democrat of Arizona, sent a letter to the agency raising concerns about the BP Atlantis and questioning its oversight of the rig.

After the disaster, Mr. Salazar said he would delay granting any new oil drilling permits.

But the minerals agency has issued at least five final approval permits to new drilling projects in the gulf since last week, records show.

Despite being shown records indicating otherwise, Ms. Barkoff said her agency had granted no new permits since Mr. Salazar made his announcement.

Other agencies besides NOAA have begun criticizing the minerals agency.

At a public hearing in Louisiana this week, a joint panel of Coast Guard and Minerals Management Service officials investigating the explosion grilled minerals agency officials for allowing the offshore drilling industry to be essentially “self-certified,” as Capt. Hung Nguyen of the Coast Guard, a co-chairman of the investigation, put it.

In addition to the minerals agency and the Coast Guard, the Deepwater Horizon was overseen by the Marshall Islands, the “flag of convenience” under which it was registered.

No one from the Marshall Islands ever inspected the rig. The nongovernmental organizations that did were paid by the rig’s operator, in this case Transocean.


Campbell Robertson contributed reporting from New Orleans, and Andy Lehren from New York.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/14/us/14agency.html?pagewanted=print

I can only conclude that the consensus bastards who went along with the IPCC and Al Gore were also afraid of losing their jobs. That is why they never reported truthfully about so much of their findings. When a scientist is paid to find a specific narrowly defined answer by powerful political agendas, they turn into consensus pussy, and forget about objective research.
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#1638243 - 05/15/10 11:40 AM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: RollnToke]
energyhazard Offline
Old hand
***

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 974
Loc: Vancouver, BC
Originally Posted By: Ben
I see no betrayal by Obama here.



I'm not sure about betrayal, I don't really care about campaign promises and all that shit...I'd call it fucking stupidity.



Originally Posted By: Ben
All I see is him stepping around stupid energyhazards who have their heads up their asses to begin with.



What the fuck are you talking about? I'M NOT AMERICAN! Oh, and go fuck yourself. I never heralded Obama as anything but the same old American politician...quote me!!! Next post, quote me saying Obama is change or anything to that effect.

Better yet, I'll quote myself.

Originally Posted By: energyhazard #1464861 - 11/09/08
Obama is the same old status quo supporter as the last guy, and the guy before him. The future sure could get worse...it could continue down the path it's been going for the past 2 decades.





That's all you see? Obama 'stepping around' Canadians? Huh? I see a status quo supporting moron. I see the same old American attitude that's been leading the country for decades. I see another environmental disaster waiting to happen.


Ben, for gods sake, how many fucking times must you be asked to make an effort to have a real debate. That means going back and responding specifically to others...not constantly slapping up articles which barely maintain flow, if at all. You haven't answered any of the challenges to your bullshit.


Originally Posted By: Ben
I can only conclude that the consensus bastards who went along with the IPCC and Al Gore were also afraid of losing their jobs. That is why they never reported truthfully about so much of their findings. When a scientist is paid to find a specific narrowly defined answer by powerful political agendas, they turn into consensus pussy, and forget about objective research.



That's the only conclusion you can come to? How in the hell did you conclude that after reading the article? Please, show us your logic, because I see none. First off, what the fuck does the IPCC and Al Gore have to do with this? Please, show us how you made that connection.

Regardless, you've distorted the story to fit your own lame argument...the problem isn't that the scientists in the article were 'being paid to find a specific narrowly defined answer"...its that the answers that their research came to were being ignored and over ridden. THAT'S why Rick Steiner took it upon himself to make his own, personal, voice heard...because his professional voice was being ignored.


Time and again you've made it blatantly obvious that you see through eyes blinded by an ignorant predefined opinion.


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#1638464 - 05/16/10 02:52 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: energyhazard]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
*

Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
Quote:
I'm not sure about betrayal, I don't really care about campaign promises and all that shit...I'd call it fucking stupidity.


Yeah sure thing you ignorant backwards Canadian. Without oil, your country would be dead in the water; moreover, your country has it`s own international conglomerate of oil companies exploring and developing oil fields abroad. They even signed oil contracts with the Kurds in Northern Iraq against the constitution and the governing body of that country. People like yourself are really easy to figure out; you make ridiculous statements against the very pillars of which you reap the most benefits from.

You`re a fake!
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#1638480 - 05/16/10 03:31 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: RollnToke]
davidmalmolevine Offline
Ganja God
***

Registered: 09/17/99
Posts: 21459
Loc: BC
"Without oil, your country would be dead in the water..."

http://hemp-ethanol.blogspot.com/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_power

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_power

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydroelectricity


Why must you lie every time your fingers hit the keyboards? What are you ... in the oil business or something?
_________________________
"making the earth a common treasury for all, both rich and poor." Gerrard Winstanley; April 20, 1649

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#1638517 - 05/16/10 06:12 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: RollnToke]
energyhazard Offline
Old hand
***

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 974
Loc: Vancouver, BC
You ignored the fact that you got called out once again on you bullshit. What's it gonna be bro? Are you going to answer back regarding my last post? Explain yourself Ben...or don't bother posting.



Originally Posted By: Ben
Yeah sure thing you ignorant backwards Canadian.


Haha..right Ben...you've only proven your own ignorance Yankee boy.


Originally Posted By: Ben
Without oil, your country would be dead in the water; moreover, your country has it`s own international conglomerate of oil companies exploring and developing oil fields abroad.


You mean without OUR oil YOUR country would be dead in the water...literally...as has been shown evident in the last month.



Originally Posted By: Ben
People like yourself are really easy to figure out; you make ridiculous statements against the very pillars of which you reap the most benefits from.


Quote me...quote these ridiculous statements.

Benefits? How does Obama deciding to keep on giving out drilling permits provide me with benefits? How do I reap the most benefits from the Alberta oil sands? Enlighten me Ben.


Originally Posted By: Ben
You`re a fake!


A fake what? Truth is I'm more real than you can handle old man...you can't even maintain a debate, you're inept at building a logical, rational argument of any sort, you live by uneducated assumptions and opinions, you fail to question the status quo, you are content with mediocrity and the norm.

Take a long look in the mirror Ben.

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#1638696 - 05/17/10 02:16 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: davidmalmolevine]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
*

Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
None of your alternatives to date have managed to keep investor money tied to these endeavors. Nothing you point to which only has promises twenty years or more down the line of much needed continuity is relevant to what Canada and the United States, Europe, Australia the UK and any other developed nation is currently inextricably tied to...coal,oil and natural gas.

Nothing you can say, nothing you can do(which appears focused on getting imprisoned) and nothing anyone can deny is our need for energy which by all accounts, actually outpaces the supply of biomass in regard to the other precious resources needed to produce an equivalency to what the world is using of fossil fuels today. You never study enough to understand and fully comprehend the harebrained fiction you spout.

Get it through your domicile; you`ll be a fat ugly old man by the time alternatives supplant current energy sources.
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#1638697 - 05/17/10 02:25 PM Re: Scientist loses funding for critizing oil industry [Re: energyhazard]
RollnToke Offline
Stoner
*

Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 424
Loc: Darkest side of the moon
Quote:
Originally Posted By: BenYou`re a fake!

A fake what? Truth is I'm more real than you can handle old man...you can't even maintain a debate, you're inept at building a logical, rational argument of any sort, you live by uneducated assumptions and opinions, you fail to question the status quo, you are content with mediocrity and the norm.

Take a long look in the mirror Ben.


Noo, you`re a fake. You have a gf enjoying an American university education. You live in Canada where during the past ten years the USA reduced carbon emissions by 16%, while Canada increased their output by over 40%. Yet you seem to think that the United States and Americans who call you a fake bullshitter are going to swallow your hypocrisy?

Either put your shit in perspective, or be a fake. You are about as realistic as Che` Guevara, the god of Cuba......doctor turned murderer.
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