Regarding your constant "Pluto warming" argument:


What's that? No one's claiming that Saturn's undergoing global warming? Right now, Cassini's orbiting Saturn all up close and personal, getting tons of cool pictures and data that would point out global warming at Saturn and on Titan. No, no one's claiming that Saturn and Titan are undergoing global warming, are they? But if the warming of the Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Triton, and Pluto are all caused by solar output, then wouldn't Saturn be experiencing global warming, too?

http://www.unspace.net/2007/03/global-warming-on-other-planets/



Mars: Many times I'm sure you've read about warming on Mars but there are a lot of sources that only relate part of the story. NASA has observed some melting of the southern polar ice cap but what's frequently not mentioned (although it's in the same NASA reports) is that the northern polar ice cap is expanding. These same reports point out that events on Mars are localised as opposed to global, not caused by the sun and not related to warming on Earth. Mars has seasonal fluctuations and it's thought that any warming is the consequence of massive dust storms that sweep across the planet.

Encaladus: Should by all accounts be cooling but it appears to be warming and no-one knows why.

Triton: Might be warming but there's no explanation.

Saturn: The only warming that's been noticed is at the southern extremity of the planet, Saturn has very long seasons and this is the part of the planet currently inclined towards the sun.

Neptune: Sometimes claimed to be warming but thought to be cooling due to a change in it's reflectivity.

Pluto: Probably the only 'planet' which we can safely say is experiencing global warming other than our own. This has ben caused by a dramatic increase in atmospheric pressure (temp goes up with pressure), in the last 14 years pressure has tripled.

Other planets: Claims are sometimes made about warming on other planets but these are attributable to nothing more than their elliptical orbit around the sun - sometimes they're nearer the sun, sometimes further away.

Only two bodies in the solar system are experiencing global warming - Earth and Pluto, some are experiencing localsied warming. The majority of planets and moons (there's 172 of them in total) have no observed temperature changes.

What warming is occuring is unique to each planet, the sun is not a factor - if it were there would be an even warming occurring on all planets and moons.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070530063017AAvDYA5








Fewer and fewer people are buying that Exxon BS, and more and more are becoming "former skeptics":


BP/Amoco was a member of the Global Climate Coalition an industry organisation established to promote global warming skepticism but withdrew in 1997, saying "the time to consider the policy dimensions of climate change is not when the link between greenhouse gases and climate change is conclusively proven, but when the possibility cannot be discounted and is taken seriously by the society of which we are part. We in BP have reached that point.".[19]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BP




He has recently written and spoken publicly about the fact that he now believes global warming is definitely real, and caused by humans.[21] At the climax of the aforementioned "Climate Chaos" documentaries, the naturalist gives this summing up of his findings:

"In the past, we didn't understand the effect of our actions. Unknowingly, we sowed the wind and now, literally, we are reaping the whirlwind. But we no longer have that excuse: now we do recognise the consequences of our behaviour. Now surely, we must act to reform it: individually and collectively; nationally and internationally — or we doom future generations to catastrophe."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Attenborough#Environmental_causes




However, he has subsequently revised his views, stating in 2005, "Anyone still holding onto the idea that there is no global warming ought to hang it up." [2]

Bailey has stated in the article "Global Warming — Not Worse Than We Thought, But Bad Enough":

Details like sea level rise will continue to be debated by researchers, but if the debate over whether or not humanity is contributing to global warming wasn't over before, it is now.... as the new IPCC Summary makes clear, climate change Pollyannaism is no longer looking very tenable.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Bailey




Cozens has stated that he was formerly a global warming skeptic but has been converted by his friend Richard Branson.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Cozens




Case Closed: The Debate about Global Warming is Over
http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2006/06energy_easterbrook.aspx



In April 2007, Gingrich held an open debate on climate change with Senator John Kerry. In this debate, he stated that he believes that global warming is indeed an occurring phenomenon: "My message, I think, is that the evidence is sufficient that we should move toward the most effective possible steps to reduce carbon loading in the atmosphere." Gingrich's environmental ideas are likely to be revealed in his forthcoming book, A Contract with the Earth, which is being published in October, 2007. At the forum Gingrich supported tax breaks to mitigate carbon emissions instead of regulations such as cap-and-trade.[18]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newt_Gingrich#Global_warming




On 4 June 2007, Howard announced a new Carbon Trading Scheme to be in place in Australia by 2012. Only four months earlier, Howard rejected such a scheme by the states, claiming "knee-jerk reactions that are going to destroy the jobs of coalminers" [92]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Howard



Michael Brant Shermer (born September 8, 1954 in Glendale, California) is a science writer, historian of science, founder of The Skeptics Society, and editor of its magazine Skeptic, which is largely devoted to investigating and debunking pseudoscientific and supernatural claims. ... In June 2006, Shermer, who formerly expressed skepticism regarding the mainstream scientific view on global warming, wrote that, in view of the accumulation of evidence, this position is no longer tenable.[8]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Shermer




Stevens, once an avowed skeptic of anthropogenic climate change, began actively supporting legislation to combat climate change in early 2007. "Global climate change is a very serious problem for us, becoming more so every day," he said at a Senate hearing, adding that he was "concerned about the human impacts on our climate."[33]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Stevens#Global_Warming

Weird weather on windy Saturn forces a rethink
Thursday, 5 June 2003



Saturn's turbulent equatorial clouds, bottom right, captured in a Voyager 1 flyby (Pic: NASA)

Saturn, one of the windiest planets known, is undergoing a dramatic weather change - equatorial jet winds have dropped sharply, prompting researchers to revise their models of the distant gas giant.

A team led by Dr Agustín Sánchez-Lavega of the University of the Basque Country in Bilbao, Spain, reports in today's issue of the journal Nature that the speed of the equatorial jet winds on Saturn has dropped by 40%.

Just over two decades ago, snapshots of the distinctive clouds in Saturn's equatorial region showed a jetstream that sped along at a bruising 1,700 km per hour. But recent observations show the winds have slowed to a relatively pedestrian 1,100 kph, according to astronomers. Outside the equatorial belt, the planet's wind speeds appear not to have changed.

Their study compares pictures taken during a flyby of the sixth planet from the Sun by the Voyager 1 robot space probe between 1980 and 1981 with images taken by the orbiting Hubble Space Telescope between 1994 and 2002.

The discovery has thrown up useful evidence about how the weather systems function on the gas giants, the huge, enigmatic planets that dominate the chilly outer reaches of the solar system. Saturn is almost as large as Jupiter - the largest planet in the Sun's family - and they both have powerful winds in the equator.

But there the similarity ends. Jupiter's jetstreams vary far less in speed than Saturn's - they are only believed to oscillate by around 10%. Saturn orbits much farther from the Sun than Jupiter, and so gets less light and warmth than the jovian giant.

Despite this, sunlight is a much bigger factor in shaping Saturn's weather than it is in Jupiter's, according to the study. This is because Saturn is tilted at a sharp angle. As it crawls along its long circuit around the Sun - each orbit takes more than 29 years on Earth - different areas of the planet are progressively warmed by the distant solar rays, and then cool again.

It takes a long time for this sunlight, coupled with relative proximity to the Sun, to affect the weather patterns. But when it does, the change is dramatic, the researchers note.

Another likely factor in the weather mechanism is the shadow cast by Saturn's broad and beautiful system of rings, which again prevents large regions from receiving sunlight for prolonged periods.

"All these differences between the planets need to be considered when developing future general circulation models for the jet origin in the giant planets," said Sánchez-Lavega and colleagues in the paper.

Saturn's atmosphere is comprised mainly of hydrogen and helium, which means it is a very light planet. It is more than nine times bigger than Earth, but just a ninth of its density.

www.abc.net.au/science/news/space/SpaceRepublish_872839.htm

I still don't see how you jumped from "global warming isn't happening" to "solar warming proves I'm right"

Seems like you are just avoiding basic facts in exchange for really out there ideas

The fearmongerers from the 1970s never did die from the impending ice age they swore was coming.

We have proof the earth has been warming and cooling for millions of years without help from humans.

We have proof the planets in our solar system are all simultaneously having climate change. Who is causing that?

Just 2 weeks ago in my neck of the woods there was a megafire. A megafire is the joining together of surrounding small fires that turn big fast because the land is so dry that almost every form of vegetation burns. Add to this aridness winds that whip into small dry tornados then morph to near hurricane intensity and the air is filled with smoke particles, dirt, dust and pollutants some of which you could only imagine.

Tonight, There was an earthquake, not sure where but it was felt here. This too is not an uncommon occurence here but the thing is this: They are becoming more frequent and much more unhealthy.

Mr Hand

You keep saying you have "proof"

can you post some of this proof that you have seen? like actual data that proves you are correct?

Go out side your home and you can clearly see the frearmongerers from the 1970's predictions," we will all freeze to death in 30 years", didn't happen.
If you need more help, google Ice age or little ice age.

okay i went outside my home and I didn't see any of the 1970s people you mentioned.

but im curious how you figured out that all the planets in our solar system are experiencing the same warming trend as Earth by googling ice age? little ice age?

can't you actually answer a question without being a total ass?

"[quote=monogratis]okay i went outside my home and I didn't see any of the 1970s people you mentioned.

but im curious how you figured out that all the planets in our solar system are experiencing the same warming trend as Earth by googling ice age? little ice age? "

My point was for you to look at the cyclical nature of our planet.
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New Storm on Jupiter Hints at Climate Change


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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1772343/posts


But how do we square the fact that almost every planet in our solar system is simultaneously undergoing temperature change and volatile weather patterns. Does this not suggest that global warming is a natural cycle as a result of the evolving nature of the sun? Can Al Gore fill me in on this one?

- Space.com: Global Warming on Pluto Puzzles Scientists
In what is largely a reversal of an August announcement, astronomers today said Pluto is undergoing global warming in its thin atmosphere even as it moves farther from the Sun on its long, odd-shaped orbit.

- Space.com: New Storm on Jupiter :oHints at Climate Change
The latest images could provide evidence that Jupiter is in the midst of a global change that can modify temperatures by as much as 10 degrees Fahrenheit on different parts of the globe.

- Current Science & Technology Center: Global Warming on Mars?
A study of the ice caps on Mars may show that the red planet is experiencing a warming trend. If both Mars and Earth are experiencing global warming, then perhaps there is a larger phenomenon going on in the Solar System that is causing their global climates to change.

- United Press International: NASA looks at a monster storm on Saturn
NASA says its Cassini spacecraft has found a hurricane-like storm at Saturn's South Pole, nearly 5,000 miles across -- or two-thirds Earth's diameter.

- Science Agogo: Global Warming Detected on Triton
There may not be much industrial pollution on Neptune's largest moon, but things are hotting up nonetheless. "At least since 1989, Triton has been undergoing a period of global warming," confirms astronomer James Elliot, professor of Earth, Atmospheric and Planetary Sciences at Massachusetts Institute of Technology. "Percentage-wise, it's a very large increase."

- Associated Press: Study says sun getting hotter
Solar radiation reaching the Earth is 0.036 percent warmer than it was in 1986, when the current solar cycle was beginning, a researcher reports in a study to be published Friday in the journal Science. The finding is based on an analysis of satellites that measure the temperature of sunlight.

- London Telegraph: The truth about global warming - it's the Sun that's to blame
Global warming has finally been explained: the Earth is getting hotter because the Sun is burning more brightly than at any time during the past 1,000 years, according to new research.

The simple fact is that throughout the ages the earth has swung wildly between a warm, wet, stable climate, to a cold, dry and windy one - long before the first fossil fuel was burned. The changes we are now witnessing are a walk in the park compared to the battering that our planet has taken in the past.

This is not a defense of the oil cartels or the Neo-Con wreckers, who would have every motivation to ignore global warming whether it is man-made or not.

Nor is it a blanket denial of the fact that the earth is getting very gradually hotter, but how do we reconcile global warming taking place at the farthest reaches of the solar system with the contention that it is caused by human activity? Have our exhaust fumes left earth's atmosphere and slipped through a black hole to Triton?

The assertion that global warming is man made is so oppressively enforced upon popular opinion, especially in Europe, that expressing a scintilla of doubt is akin to holocaust denial in some cases. Such is the insipid brainwashing that has taken place via television, newspapers and exalted talking heads - global warming skeptics are forced to wear the metaphoric yellow star and only discuss their doubts in hushed tones and conciliatory frameworks, or be cat-called, harangued and jeered by an army of do-gooders who righteously believe they are rescuing mother earth by recycling a wine bottle or putting their paper in a separate trash can.

Fearmongering about an imminent climate doomsday also hogs news coverage and important environmental issues like GM food, mad scientist chimera cloning and the usurpation and abuse of corporations like Monsanto flies under the radar.

Global warming is cited as an excuse to meter out further control and surveillance over our daily lives, RFID chips on our trash cans, GPS satellite tacking and taxation by the mile, as well as a global tax at the gas pump.

The extremist wing of the environmentalist movement, characterized by people like Dr. Erik Pianka, advocate the mass culling of humanity via plagues and state sanctioned bio-terrorism, in order to "save" the earth from the disease of humanity. Nazi-like genocial population control measures and the environmental establishment have always held a close alliance.

The orthodox organized religion of global warming and its disastrous consequences for our freedom of speech, freedom of mobility and our right to remain outside of the system, needs to be questioned on the foundational basis that the phenomenon is solar-system wide and it is mainly caused by the natural evolution of the sun and not human activity.

[url=http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2006/161106suvjupiter.htm]

the idea that the Sun plays a significant role in the climate of Earth is not debated. if there is indeed an increase in the sun's output, is it enough to justify the events happening on Earth?

Is it possible that the changing of Earth's climate could be attributed to BOTH massive increases in greenhouse gases and an increase in solar intensity?

I still can't help but think all the shit that is flowing into our ocean, the dead spots where there are no more phytoplankton to absorb solar energy and carbon dioxide, and the changes in the composition of the atmosphere have some significance in the future of the planet